I need an exhuast....

Come here to discuss the performance side of our vehicles.
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Spyda
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Postby Spyda » Sun Sep 01, 2002 3:32 am

OK guys its a little off topic but I just have to add this in the spirit of the rice catagorizing above....

This is my theory of the automotive world....

two basic kinds of automotive customizers....rodders and gear heads (of course there are crosses between the two, but for arguments sake...).

the rodders are typically more interested in the apperance of the vehicle....now the old skool rodders and the new school rodders (aka minitruckers lol:) get along just fine, mainly because we still do what they did 150 some odd years ago :)....vehicles are still made out of metal (mostly), there are still swaps to be made, and custom paint never gets old.

now the gearheads of yesteryear absolutly despise the ricers when in fact they are doing pretty much the same thing that most of them did when they were young...for example....
cold air intake = bigger carburator
cherry bomb = catback
60 series rubber (low profile back then) = 40 series rubber
15" Cragers = 17" Racing Harts
B+M ratchet shift = short throw shifter

I don't get it....why don't they get along? The only thing I can figure out is the attitudes....forgive my stereotyping, but most ricers are punks, and most muscle-car-guys were most likely punks back in their day - do they think the ricers are taking over their territory or something?
somebody shine some light on this please

Peace,
Spyda
PBC
...but the stone that the builder refused...shall be the head cornerstone...
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sandt38
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Postby sandt38 » Sun Sep 01, 2002 9:53 am

now the gearheads of yesteryear absolutly despise the ricers when in fact they are doing pretty much the same thing that most of them did when they were young...for example....
cold air intake = bigger carburator
cherry bomb = catback
60 series rubber (low profile back then) = 40 series rubber
15" Cragers = 17" Racing Harts
B+M ratchet shift = short throw shifter

I don't get it....why don't they get along? The only thing I can figure out is the attitudes....forgive my stereotyping, but most ricers are punks, and most muscle-car-guys were most likely punks back in their day - do they think the ricers are taking over their territory or something?
somebody shine some light on this please

Peace,
Spyda
PBC


I would be glad to shine a light on this for you as an old school gearhead.

Cold Air intake is no where near a bigger carburetor. A bigger carb allows for greater amounts or air and fuel to enter the combustion chamber. Intakes of old were choked up by smaller carbs, they were able to flow far greater amounts than the carb allowed. To make a more fair comparison you should have said...

Bigger Carb=cold air intake, intake manifold, injectors, FP regulator, and computer chip.

60 series rubber was a standard profile (when the current system for measuring tires came about) on most performance cars and 70 on "so so" packages. The greater surface area on the side of the tire allows it to wrinkle, putting more tread to the ground, and maintain traction. Something else you are leaving out here is the tire width. A tire designated as 235-70-R15 (a typical stock tire size on an older rwd car) has a sidewall hieght of 164.5mm. Now, I am getting some 60s, I'll go to a 285-60-R15. That is a sidewall hieght of 171mms. lower profile tire huh?

Cherry bomb and cat back? The systems kids put on today sound like a fart, not a rumble. I like a good sounding exhaust, if it is done well I'm all for it. But when a car sounds like a lawnmower, I laugh and catch myself saying "stupid kids". Darn I'm old, I can't believe I say that.

15Cragers and 17 Harts? See above for advantages of greater sidewall hieght.

B&M ratchet and Short throw? I like Hurst dual gates personally:D . But really, most of the short throws are on slow cars. What differance does it make to do that?

That is an opinion, not gospel. I think the points made are quite obvious though. I am just a crotchety old man who happens to love and miss the old muscle cars. I own the newest true muscle car to date, and I am saddened by its 17th birthday coming up in December. Where has all the fun gone? Will we ever see it again? Oh wait, The Holden Monaro with the Vette engines will be here soon, called the GTO... We'll see if it has those classy MC lines.;)
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nismo
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Postby nismo » Sun Sep 01, 2002 12:31 pm

my comment is that there is a difference between putting effort into making your car look good, and trying to make your car LOOK fast the ghetto way. wtf is up with putting stickers on your car for equipment you dont have? i dont call that new school rodders...i call that rice. and most of the time, they do stuff as cheaply as possible (torching/cutting springs) to make it look like they spent tons of money on their cars when they havent.

im more interested in blending in with all the stock cars out there, cuz i really dont wanna be targeted by the cops. when i get my new car, tint, wheels, and custom tail lights (red/clears--not that altezza crap) and my car will look fairly stock until you get right up to it. i do want to get the go-fast goodies tho. my goal is 2x the stock rated hp...AT the front wheels :D that takes a lot no matter what car you start with.

eric
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Spyda
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Postby Spyda » Sun Sep 01, 2002 12:42 pm

I know that the comparisons I made above are not exact, but I was just listing them to show that the ricers do just about the same sort of thing that guys did to their muscle cars back in the day (except a little more half-assed). I also thought of a few more differences...

most muscle-car guys could rebuilt an engine by the time they were 18....most ricers probably couldn't even tell you how the engine works

gearheads are concerned more with performance with looks as a side-concern....ricers sometimes are the exact opposite (which would sort of make them fall into the rodder catagory, but bolt-ons aren't custom).

also, about the tires - I was wrong on that one....the old-school gearheads didn't really care about low=pro rubber....they just wanted it thicker (sorry, it was late and I don't know what I was thinking)

Peace,
Spyda
PBC
...but the stone that the builder refused...shall be the head cornerstone...
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sandt38
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Postby sandt38 » Sun Sep 01, 2002 12:59 pm

Originally posted by nismo
my comment is that there is a difference between putting effort into making your car look good, and trying to make your car LOOK fast the ghetto way. wtf is up with putting stickers on your car for equipment you dont have? i dont call that new school rodders...i call that rice. and most of the time, they do stuff as cheaply as possible (torching/cutting springs) to make it look like they spent tons of money on their cars when they havent.

im more interested in blending in with all the stock cars out there, cuz i really dont wanna be targeted by the cops. when i get my new car, tint, wheels, and custom tail lights (red/clears--not that altezza crap) and my car will look fairly stock until you get right up to it. i do want to get the go-fast goodies tho. my goal is 2x the stock rated hp...AT the front wheels :D that takes a lot no matter what car you start with.

eric


Exactly what I'm talking about.

I work very hard to keep my car under wraps. I have put intense effort into maintaining a stock appearance, while almost doubleing HP and torque figures. I have fat tires on the rear that maintain stock hieght. I have done intense internal engine work to bring the power to tremendous levels (for a 6 cylinder street car) when I could have put alot of gaudy bolt on stuff and created more insane amounts of power, yet with alot of flash. I prefer to have people say "that's nice" then when they see it fly say, "holy SSSHHHHHHIIIIIIITTTTTT!!!!!!";)
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Postby nismo » Sun Sep 01, 2002 1:42 pm

my biggest complaint about ricers is that they worry about how theyll look...and sometimes when they mod stuff, it makes their car worse than stock...(ie torching springs, etc.), and some of the crap they do makes them slower than the car was factory, yet they think they are fast, just b/c 'it's loud'...or some ish like that.

eric

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